When they go low, how can we go high

More than anything, I hope we can still express our pain, anger, passion, fear and, yes, our disgust at what is going on and what is being said. I think we can do that and still raise the bar to a higher level. 

As @lovendures wrote, it does NOT mean I back off at all. It just means that I don't sling mud at other humans.  (And that I can be forgiving of myself and others when we slip up and sling the mud.)

I can sling all the mud in the world at the points made. I can stay emotional and passionate too. 

@deetoo, things you just wrote that I need to remember:We’re all works in progress, aren’t we? and There are no easy answers.  This is hard stuff.  We make some of it up as we go along. Then your quotes from @barry and @ana, mind bogglingly good.

Now I want to extend my compassion for folks here who live in very red country where they might be hit up close with insults to their philosophy, and bullying as well. 

I live in a blue state. But I get involved in local politics where people in my community end out on different sides of controversies, and someone who was your ally on one issue, is on the opposite side in another issue.  It's confusing for the mind that wants to throw people into white hats and black hats. 

I get passionate about the issues I take on. So emotions run high and I want to dehumanize my adversaries because it makes it so much simpler for me to assume I'm wearing the white hat here.  

But inevitably I run into one of these adversaries socially, and when that happens, and I get to know them even just a little, it explains why I feel so bad when I think awful thoughts about them personally and even worse when I speak publicly against them in an insensitive way.

I realize that they have their own stories and reasons and if you get down to the basic reasons within them, it's not so far from your own. For more complex socio-psychological reasons, they took a different approach, one that I abhor, but their humanity is real. 

The low road doesn't work on any level. 

This whole thread belongs in the Hall of Fame.

I really can't add anything more.  I have often felt as you all are expressing here so eloquently.  

I love the fact when I visit with our community, I leave changed.  Often a bit more grounded or mindful.  Sometimes challenged or reflective.  I might even carry back with me some hope, compassion, love or wisdom to pass along to someone else I interact with during my day or to help me evolve into the person I hope to become.

What a mindfully beautiful thread.

I wanted to reply yesterday, but just couldn't get to it. My computer has issues (like many of us) and I wasn't about to try doing it from my phone.

I moved to what I thought was a blue alcove in a red state. NC to be exact-the same state where gerrymandering was done (according to the judge striking down our districts) with the precision of a surgeon's knife. For the first decade + here, I had a Dem as a House Rep, but once the new illegal districts were made, he chose not to waste money running again when there was no chance to win.

I-like many of you- have parents or other relatives who are T supporters, likewise neighbors, and folks who are clients or folks I work with. One time my son said part of the reason he was leaving the area was because of the red narrow-mindedness closing in. My response? If all of us leave instead of staying to try and change things, there's no hope of making a change. It raised a few eyebrows among his friends who were present, and several who were also talking of leaving chose to stay & fight.

As a survivor of many things-there are many lessons I've learned that help me deal with such folks. First, you can't change the minds of those who believe in conspiracy theories. It is actually a form of mental illness. This is similar to what those who have been brainwashed by skewed media suffer. They believe they know something that others can't grasp, so like ailments such as narcissism, their self delusion can't be pierced. I don't argue with them, I did enough of that with the conspiracy buffs after Monica's accident to learn the futility of doing so. I've literally walked the reconstruction, but they would tell me how they know it better-sight unseen. It's not worth the waste of energy. Remember these folks are afraid of not fitting in or being different. Here, we've all known we were somewhat different, and have learned to deal with that.

When they start in with name calling or abuse, here again survivorship kicks in for me. Eleanor Roosevelt noted that "no one can make you feel inferior without your permission." Don't give them permission. Let their opinion be their problem, not yours. This includes their opinion of you. Another survivor's note: no one, no matter what they say about me or do to me physically can defile me. Only my own actions or my words can do so. How other's treat me is their Karma, how I react is mine.

Keep in mind that while those who are on the other end of the political spectrum from many of us here, most are still decent people at their core. In hurricanes when folks are in need, they don't ask who you voted for or your party affiliation when they put boats into floodwaters to save those in need, or when they show up to work at makeshift kitchens to feed hot meals to those without power for days or weeks. They show up with chain saws to clear trees, etc., just like progressives do.

I've worked in many houses where they are T supporters, and my friend and I just keep our mouths shut. We've heard them talking about the need for civil war and other such nonsense. Yet some of these same folks got to know us without knowing our politics, and they hug us when they see us again, and treat us like family.

We're all human. People make mistakes or hold false beliefs. I've had a sibling who used to physically attack me, and I've had my father try as well. I defended myself when I needed to. I cherish the fact that in each instance, while I defended myself, I tried to make sure I didn't hurt them in return if I could help it. That is what makes me different from them. In the heat of the moment, while fists were flying, or someone was trying to throw me down a flight of stairs, I could think rationally-if I throw punches or push back-they'll fall down the stairs, or they could hit the glass window behind them and get hurt, so I altered my defense accordingly. I thought of more than myself in those situations, and the highest and best outcomes came about. Their attacks don't make them evil-it is a sign of being mentally unwell. My responses viewed thru my own perspective are a reassurance that I am different-even in spite of being raised or living in the same environment, and that I cherish. We all have the choice to not sink to their level. It's often a matter of respecting ourselves that allows us to rise above the fray and do what's right instead of sinking to wallow in the mud slinging. Sometimes the best way to convert others who can be persuaded is by example.

I am a diplomat and I have always held some compassion for all of these deranged people. Still I have unfriended people who have tried to bludgeon me with articles that defend all the bad, and dangerous behavior. 

I did lose my temper two times which felt empowering, once when someone I considered a close friend kept posting conspiracy theories on a private thread I had started for support, and another who insisted on calling Dr. Levine a "thing." I have friends with trans kids and I have no time for this particular cruelty. I have no patience anymore for those who spread hatred and intolerance on my personal social media. It is not okay and I simply will not tolerate it, although I do privately pray for those two people, that they may see the error of their ways.

I don't like fat shaming, and I do feel pretty people are ugly when they dabble in hate. I will not hate these people. I will see them as the wounded children they are AND be protective and work to counteract them.  This includes unplugging and tagging out when I become overwhelmed. 

The British baking show is a favorite. Unlike the American versions they all seem to route for each other and it is a pleasure to watch. 

I think we can and should hold people accountable, but we can do that without dehumanizing them, even if it's hard to do so because they are behaving in ways that dehumanize others. I don't think compassion means enabling. We can and should respond, even harshly, to very bad behavior. Doing so, I believe, helps the person who is out of line. It's not good for someone's spiritual evolution to just be allowed to continue behaving abominably without getting a metaphorical slap on the face. My true friends tell me hard truths, even if they know I may get angry or upset. That's how I know they care about me. People who enable bad, cruel behavior don't care about anything but creating chaos for their own benefit. 

Accountability also means, to me, that people don't just get forgiveness. Forgiveness comes when the transgressor seeks it. It involves making amends and seeking to be forgiven. So much is written about how people "need" to forgive. I don't buy that. It lays too much on the injured party. Sure, if situations are irresolvable because an offending party doesn't admit they are wrong, eventually we just have to move on, but distancing ourselves from hard feelings doesn't mean the offender's transgressions are extinguished. The people who have brought so much pain to our society in the past 4+ years (including MTG, 45, et al) are NOT forgiven until they make things right. However, I do think we must deal with them and speak about them in ways that are not cruel, not just for their benefit but for our own spiritual integrity. 

Sometimes easier said than done...:)

Happy Tuesday everyone!

@ghandigirl Being a diplomat you must be exposed to different cultures and ways of life. That's an amazing teaching resource for those who want to learn and understand other cultures.  

Agree about the kindness of The Great British Baking Show.  Our oldest was offered jobs all over the country but chose the offer that was abroad because the culture was more respectful and polite.  

"Paul Hollywood City Bakes" is on youtube. He travels through various cities around the world enjoying local specialties. Thanks to Paul, a successful focaccia was produced and shared at my house yesterday ? and lifted the vibe for all of us.  

Posted by: @lynnventura

I think we can and should hold people accountable, but we can do that without dehumanizing them, even if it's hard to do so because they are behaving in ways that dehumanize others. I don't think compassion means enabling. We can and should respond, even harshly, to very bad behavior. Doing so, I believe, helps the person who is out of line. It's not good for someone's spiritual evolution to just be allowed to continue behaving abominably without getting a metaphorical slap on the face. My true friends tell me hard truths, even if they know I may get angry or upset. That's how I know they care about me. People who enable bad, cruel behavior don't care about anything but creating chaos for their own benefit. 

Totally agree with that.  It's the same with raising children.  It's not good for their growth if they escape consequences of their bad behavior.  But as you say, calling them out has to be done "without dehumanizing them".   Like a child gets a lecture on what they did wrong, why it was wrong, and then they have to go in time out.  We don't beat them.  The message of correction is lost if the consequence is dispensed with too much heat and anger.   It's harder to do this with adults-- so the analogy is not perfect-- but calling people out is much more effective if you can keep your cool while doing it.    

Accountability also means, to me, that people don't just get forgiveness. Forgiveness comes when the transgressor seeks it. It involves making amends and seeking to be forgiven. So much is written about how people "need" to forgive. I don't buy that. It lays too much on the injured party. Sure, if situations are irresolvable because an offending party doesn't admit they are wrong, eventually we just have to move on, but distancing ourselves from hard feelings doesn't mean the offender's transgressions are extinguished. The people who have brought so much pain to our society in the past 4+ years (including MTG, 45, et al) are NOT forgiven until they make things right.

I think it may boil down to how one defines "forgiveness".  Some people will never understand why what something they did was wrong. (Or they may honestly not remember it ever happened.)  And as you say, the injured party must eventually move on- for their own mental and spiritual health .  The "moving on" and letting go--which should naturally result in the the cessation of (deliberately or inadvertantly) sending "bad vibes" to the transgressor-- is one definition of forgiveness.  In that sense, it doesn't mean the injured person has to forget about the transgression and pretend it never happened. 

What do we mean by "forgiveness"? 

I like this discussion (and this forum) because everyone here makes me hold myself to a higher standard and ask myself a lot of questions. It seems like If I'm really open and honest about myself, it opens a door for spirit to weigh in. Its also humbling because there are so many amazing people here. And I learn from everyone.
I want to acknowledge that this is all seriously hard stuff. Kudos to everyone who tries. Its rough to keep getting knocked down and getting back up, over and over, day after day. The outrage, and feelings of futility are intense and daily. (By Jeanne's chart we are at the bottom collectively right now, raise your hand if you were like me and underestimated what that would REALLY be like) I understand why people give up, get bitter, and go low. Why they lose themselves, and why they want give back what they've been given, both dark and light. I read the news, I also separately read very sober, intelligent sources. I listen to spirit when I can quiet myself enough to hear it (no small task these days) and I hear "trust that everything is as it should be" but... but... but, I feel like Im 4 years old again. I'm so beyond outraged too. I'm exhausted, in pain, most days I feel like Ive been hit by a truck, mentally and physically. And it just keeps coming. I cant explain why I want to go high. Spirit whispers in my ear "You're learning to fly". I get flustered and respond "The hell I am! I'm learning to crash!". Even quieter "Thats why you're being taught to fly". I cant escape the image of Michelle Obama holding George W's hand and embracing him. The look on his face. Who am I to say he didn't deserve that? Don't we all? I want to be hugged by her. And then the realization hit me, her hug was a maybe fleeting moment for GW. Maybe it was life changing, I'll never know. For Michelle, thats who she is, she is filled with so much light and love she can share it freely. Thats what I want. I don't want someone to give me a fish and feed me for day, I want to learn to fish. I want so many fish I can share them freely. So yeah, I'm guilty of all this too. Just as often as not, I have said my fair share of ugly things about people that I judged to be the "bad" people. There's the problem, I judged them; I went there. (I say "bad" as an illustration of part of my judging). There are so many people I want to quote in this thread, it would go on and on. Im going keep it to a minimum to keep it brief. Its a great thread. I will quote this because it gets to the heart of what I feel too : @cindy beautifully pointed out " I cherish the fact that in each instance, while I defended myself, I tried to make sure I didn't hurt them in return if I could help it. That is what makes me different from them". We do have to be different from them, thats the point. We want to raise the collective conscious, the vibration, the light, to make it better for everyone or we risk becoming what we fear in the "others". I too could have expressed my feelings of outrage, disappointment, upset, hurt, any number of legitimate feelings without injuring myself or them. Those feelings could have been expressed without injury. Attacking with words, written or spoken, is a form of violence that carries its own vibrational component. I don't like thinking of myself in those terms either, but it's part of growing. I have been trying for a while now to reframe my responses. When I fail, I try to look within myself. Is this really about me? (yes, and I don't like that at all). It's a lesson to show where I can grow.

I did want add to @lynnventura & @ana 's posts about forgiveness. My understanding of forgiveness is that it's for us. Its not at all a get out of jail free card for the perpetrator. It's an acceptance on our part that what happened, did in fact happen and we can't change that. We can let go of it in the sense that we don't want to add to the injury. We can focus on healing, ourselves and other victims, not give our energy and healing away to the one(s) who caused the injury. Make some sort of peace with our own resentment for whatever happened. The plea for justice, when it goes unanswered, grows into a cancerous form of vengeance. To carry the anger of vengeance is a poison to a heart. It closes and hardens the heart. A heart that's closed and hardened isn't open to healing. It creates the endless cycles of violence. Hurt can be healed, revenge can never be healed. The hurt will always be with us, but in healing we can learn to live with it as what it is - a hurt - (not to minimize that in any way - yes, it can be an absolutely devastating hurt). In forgiving we can prevent that hurt from turning cancerous against us. By holding onto it and imagining that the person who inflicted it can be somehow be made to balance it, will only continue to add to the hurt. And add to it. And add to it. By not making peace with our hurts, they not only grow poisonous, but they accumulate, each one adding to the ones that came before. Forgiveness is a way of giving the wrong back in the form of saying "I may always hurt from this, but that is not who I am, it's who you are" And walk away. Forgiveness is for the victim, accountability is a separate facet of a wrong. Someone who wrongs another must be held to account. There must be justice. We are struggling to create a world where all are equal before the law and justice is fairly and every applied to every single person, every single time. We aren't there. This consciousness has been awaked.

@barry. I love your posts on forgiveness and I have learned over a lifetime the importance of forgiving those who have caused me harm.  That said, in forgiving the people who have hurt me the most, I remain mindful of the harm they have caused and do not put myself in harm’s way again.  It’s really, really hard to forgive someone who shows no remorse and continues abusive behavior, but I’ve found that the act of forgiveness brings me peace and serenity.  Mind you, I may have to work at forgiveness a long time and ask for help from higher powers to achieve that state, but it can be done.  One method that has worked for me is to pray for blessings for those who have hurt me.  Every time I would think of them and the damage they have done, I would stop that stream of thought and replace it will a prayer that they be blessed, that their lives be full and happy.  The people I’ve struggled to forgive have never apologized, shown remorse or changed their dark, destructive energy.  However, in the process of forgiveness, I have protected myself from further harm and set myself free from bitterness and resentment.  The act of forgiving is transformative and healing to the forgiver.

@bluebelle Wow, you definitely have more grace than me, its a beautiful thing that you can pray for them to be blessed with happiness and full lives! Thank you for that, I can see the beauty of it. And the difficulty! My mind is already wrestling with actually doing it. It feels like a purification in some sense to the one doing the forgiving. I would never advocate that anyone put themselves in harm's way again, thats an important point.

Posted by: @barry

@bluebelle Wow, you definitely have more grace than me, its a beautiful thing that you can pray for them to be blessed with happiness and full lives! Thank you for that, I can see the beauty of it. And the difficulty! My mind is already wrestling with actually doing it. It feels like a purification in some sense to the one doing the forgiving. I would never advocate that anyone put themselves in harm's way again, thats an important point.

Grace is hard to learn.  The best way is just to give in and do it, no matter what your pride or ego or anger tells you.   Then it gets easier. 

@ana. You’re exactly right.  You just do it.  You set an intention to forgive even if you’re still struggling with the offense.  By setting the intention and striving to be your higher self, you’re setting yourself free from ego, grudges, and negative thinking.

Forgiveness when one has been hurt can be a diffucult concept because of our emotional responses. When a customer defaults on a loan, the financial institution sometimes forgives the loan. It doesn't mean that not repaying is condoned, liked, or swept under the rug. It means that the company figures it would be more costly to try to continue to collect, so they write it off-let it go. Without emotion, they let the numbers speak. Forgiveness for many is for themselves-not those who were the perpetrator. I like to believe that Karma will settle the score. It lets me off the hook. I no longer carry the weight of worrying if there will be justice. 

I have no clue what the other individual's purpose or life lessons are to be, therefore I figure it's not my place to judge if they've earned the right to be forgiven. If someone wrongs me, apologizes, makes ammends, sure I have a clue they deserve it.

Otherwise, I am clueless as to what their spiritual role was, so I can't sit in judgement, therefore I forgive for my own benefit so I can move on. If their predetermined role was to do something that hurts me or someone else, how do I know who the teacher & who the student were to be in the lesson? In spirit, that soul may need to learn how not to hurt others, therefore I am the teacher. Whether they learn their lesson is their responsibility. On the other hand, that soul may ordinarily never hurt a fly, so they incarnated with the mission to cause harm so they can understand guilt or some other aspect of being the perpetrator in order to aid souls trying learn how to abandon such behaviors. In that case, I'm just a tool in the lesson. They don't need my forgiveness for that. 

We've all heard stories of how a single kind act sometimes changed someone else's life. Being lightworkers we accept these things happen & they happen for a reason. We look for the light & try to envelop others in it as well. It's sometimes hard not to be judgemental of those who seemingly don't see the benefit of the light. But without those who can demonstrate the flip side, the quality and quantity of lessons to be learned on this plane would be limited. How many Trumpsters are true neanderthals, and how many are spiritual teachers assuming a role to help those on the fence make their own choices? How can one differenitate the neanderthal from the spiritual teacher assuming that role for the sake of teaching others? This is why I try to stay in my own lane, worrying about my own lessons. It's why I choose to be Pollyanna-ish about most things.

@theungamer

I don't work as a diplomat, but I have been a teacher of many children from other countries, and worked with hundreds of families over the last 40 years and counting.

What I meant to convey is I am very diplomatic, most of the time. 

Posted by: @cindy

Forgiveness when one has been hurt can be a diffucult concept because of our emotional responses. When a customer defaults on a loan, the financial institution sometimes forgives the loan. It doesn't mean that not repaying is condoned, liked, or swept under the rug. It means that the company figures it would be more costly to try to continue to collect, so they write it off-let it go. Without emotion, they let the numbers speak.

I think this is an excellent analogy. 

Justice and punishment are really just socially acceptable methods for obtaining revenge. It is a method that humans have developed to try to impart order in a chaotic world by tempering the passion of individuals with the, theoretically, greater dispassion of a collective. There is nothing good or bad about it, it is exactly what we have needed up until now.  However, our paradigm is shifting and we are raising our awareness towards ever greater Unity.  We are beginning to understand that we are not just individual islands, fully blocked off from any other individual whom we choose not to interact with. We are actually indivisibly connected to all others. We are unique facets of an all encompassing Universal Consciousness. 

As we continue on this path of awakening, society will come to realize that punishment is a self defeating path. The human body is a good metaphor to understand this.  We are comprised of millions of individual cells of immense diversity. However, they all work together for the greater good of the body.  When some of these cells, for example immune cells, begin behaving in damaging ways we don't demand justice. Rather, we ask for healing.  That is exactly what our collective body needs; healing for the individuals causing our collective dis-ease.  The greatest, most powerful medicine we as individual cells and as a social body have is Love, and, as Lightworkers, our job is to be the world's super-spreaders. ❤️ 

@frank 

That is an enlightening and beautiful post Frank.  Thank you! 

I feel lifted up after reading it.

Posted by: @bluebelle

@ana. You’re exactly right.  You just do it.  You set an intention to forgive even if you’re still struggling with the offense.  By setting the intention and striving to be your higher self, you’re setting yourself free from ego, grudges, and negative thinking.

I so agree.  After a difficult divorce, I wanted to forgive in order to let go.  So, in meditation and prayer, I made a statement, "I completely forgive_______."  Now, I did this through gritted teeth in the beginning, but I always added, "Please, Lord, make my forgiveness real."  In time, my intention became completely sincere.  @bluebelle's advice is important too--to send blessings.  As my forgiveness became more sincere, it became easier to send blessings.  It's very liberating to one's soul.