[Closed] The Great Unraveling and the Great Turning - Rebuilding a Progressive America in the Future

@ana

I see what you meant to say here, though I believe it was misunderstood by many perhaps?

And may I say, in deference to the justified outrage and anger of many, in the spirit of positive change :

THERE AIN'T NO "GLORY" IN VIOLENCE!!!

I live in Minneapolis, three blocks north of one of the epicenters. Have been watching street media since this started--videographers embedded in the protests. I've seen a lot. 

Yes, the call went out on the deep web for the "Boogaloo Bois" to come to Minneapolis to "get their loot on." These accelerationists want a civil war. They bang out windows with hammers, then use protesters as human shields by hiding within the protests, thus drawing ire down on the Black Lives Matter protesters, who are blamed for the vandalism. One Boi shot somebody at a park 5 blocks from here.

It's been three nights of constant helicopter overflights, sirens, screaming, the smell of smoke, flash-bangs, gunshots. I am very, very tired and even more heartsick. 

Damages: Lake street looks like Beruit. Many buildings burnt down to the brick shell. This map will show you the sheer volume of the attacks: 

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=13oQaWXH9XVMNn_SM0xQCCPGqI6Rr-Kd5&ll=44.94924364144036%2C-93.26282724628706&z=14&fbclid=IwAR0CHxnPU3KvpI1SrJZvpuMjIXLhonYZQcV7Tf4o7PT11iBvaaB7vOlhzdw

My personal losses include: The place I buy books, Uncle Hugo's Science Fiction--burned to the ground. That one was two blocks away. Walgreens where I pick up meds--damaged and closed. The bank we deposit rent at--same. The Target I shop at--well, that's been on national news. A business I work for--looted. The Global Market I get most stuff at--looted. The shop I had my sewing machine at for repairs--the roof's burnt off the building, and I can't reach the woman to find out how she's doing. 

So many grocery stores were damaged--there is only one left functioning for three miles--food is being distributed by food drives and popup charities.

I've slept with my camping axe under my pillow for the last two nights. I've been in coping mode since this started. 

Today, I am grieving. HARD.

Asking for prayers. For myself. For my ravaged city. For the soul of our country, shuddering under the strain.

RunestoneOne

@runestoneone

Most certainly, I am praying for you, your city, our country, our disenfranchised, our broken, our disillusioned.  I am so deeply sorry and terribly saddened for the losses you and your city have experienced.  Words seem so futile in a time like this, but our energy as light workers is not futile and our hopes, dreams and visions of a better future are not futile.  

In the meantime, while we wish for tomorrow to come fast, we can join you and your community in determination, determination that the real culprits behind the violence are not only revealed, but acknowledged by the majority of our country.  

I am sending you healing, RunestoneOne and strength to get through this and the lead others by your example.  Much love to you.  May the oppressed be heard and may justice prevail.

@runestoneone  So many prayers.

And this piece lifted my spirits: solidarity protest around the world. https://abcnews.go.com/International/black-lives-matter-protests-global-ireland-south-africa/story?id=40546549&fbclid=IwAR0MO2yYLa0oNGi2TeTB4tMVtK8dQ4w1TwUNk-hskvUz41JQ8NsrQny-yP4

Posted by: @seeker4

@jeanne-mayell @ana @Laura-F  Yes, I am also a white person of privilege.  In the 90's I dined with a black friend who was also of privilege.  She was getting her Ph.D. and her husband was a successful businessman.  We were chatting about our teen age sons when she asked me, "Do you allow your son to run down the sidewalk?"  I said, naively, "Yes, of course. Don't you."  She replied, "No, we teach him to walk, even if he's late." This family lived in a well-to-do neighborhood, but it didn't matter.  The danger was real everywhere.  I truly got it then.

I got it too, and it crosses all socio economic groups but is much worse in lower income areas.  In my sheltered life, I have known too many stories all around me. I can't imagine what it is like for people of color and especially those in lower income areas. 

In 1990, the number one NBA draft pick, Dee Brown and his fiancee were stopped by a handful of Wellesley police officers with guns drawn after he was misidentified by a white bank employee as a suspect in a robbery.  Brown was forced out of his car where he was parked to mail a letter at the Post Office and forced searched on the ground spread eagle. His fiancee sat in the car after telling the police they were ruffing up the top NBA draft pick. Then she just had one thing to say: "I hate fucking cops." Once he showed them identification and they realized their mistake, the police let him go.  Had he been poor or just alone without identification, he could have been killed. 

Afterwards, my husband and I were talking about it with a black journalist friend who was surprised that we didn't realize being detained for nothing other than being black was common place for black men. A highly educated, well-spoken man, he had gotten stopped many  times, including one scary incident where the police detained him for several hours while he was out jogging because someone reported a shoplifting by a man of color.  

@laura-f I live in St. Paul- thank you for sharing the quote from the restaurant owner; it completely encapsulates how I have been feeling about bearing witness to the pain and suffering of our friends and neighbors in service of justice.

@runestoneone

My heart is with you, and my prayers for an end to the violence.

Violence and hatred just manifest more violence, death and destruction.

It was the violent murder of George Floyd that sparked this volcano of outrage, but it has taken on another life as the anger and aggression of many different influences have congealed to create an entity of gargantuan proportions.

I am deeply saddened by the fact that Mr Floyd's life was taken in such horrendous violence, and continues to be dishonored by more of the same.

There is a better way forward ....

Trust in Spirit and stay grounded as it all comes to Light ?

@runestoneone  Effing Hell. I looked at the map  My family visited Minneapolis 2 years ago on vacation and thought "what a nice place this is".   I hope you and yours are still OK!

(DISCLAIMER: I get that every "nice place" may have its undercurrents of bad sh*t that needs to be rooted out,  but damn anyway.)

As you could see from my may posts last night, it was a difficult night.  Watching the hundreds, likely over a thousand people, storming the Scottsdale Fashion Square mall and raiding the businesses in the area was surreal.  At the same time police in downtown Phoenix were trying to wrangle in a mass of protestors.  We now have a weeklong curfew which like many other states will begin at 8:00pm.  In our case, we also had a police caused death of a civilian on Monday which is causing turmoil in Arizona.  A state DPS trooper came across a car blocking partially a lane on the side of a highway.  The man in the car was asleep.  The stop ended with the man in the vehicle shot dead and no dash cam or body camera footage to show what exactly happened.  

Now for the positive news in this big mess.  There were some good things that came from last night here in Arizona. This morning,  many volunteers showed up with brooms, bags and buckets and helped clean up the local shops.  If you go to the link below and scroll, you will find a collection of photos of some of the volunteers hard at work helping.  

Also, if you haven't read their full statements ( posted a few pages back) Joe Biden and John Lewis each showed their humanity and leadership with beautiful words to guide and inspire us all.  You should read them and not just a quote from them.  

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/politics/arizona/2020/05/31/arizona-gov-ducey-declares-state-emergency-weeklong-8-p-m-curfew/5301432002/

In the unraveling thread I posted a number of journalists whoo were either arrested or shot with rubber bullets over the past few days.  One female journalist is now perminately blind because of a rubber bullet. 

Live last night on TV in Arizona, I saw a police officer aim their gun at journalists you could see the barrel of the gun aimed directly at the photo journalists.  It was that photo journalists perspective that was being recorded.  The lens of the photo journalist captured the riffle trained right on him.  Lens on lens so to speak.  It scared the heck out of me.  There was no mistaking that the photo journalist and reporter were "press".

I also heard an officer in Phoenix tell a journalist that because the protest had now been deemed an unlawful assembly, the reporter could legally be arrested for being there covering the story.

That was a shocking statement to hear.  Why is it ok to arrest the press covering an unlawful assembly????

@runestoneone

Thank you for posting a first hand account of how the aftermath of the rioting has affected you and your neighborhood.  I can't even begin to imagine the loss and bewilderment you must be feeling. My hope for yo and your neighb=hood is for healing to begin and the regrowth and rebirth be a blessing for all.

@jeanne-mayell  So heartbreaking.  Once our eyes opened, we saw it everywhere.  Mailing a letter while black, jogging while black, bird watching while black....  Where will it end?  

Posted by: @ana

Like if some dude beats his wife and the next morning says, "Sorry honey, I was drunk and had a bad day at the office. Just venting."    OK, that's a reason for the behavior but it certainly does not excuse it. 

@ana, as a matter of integrity, I must point out what I find to be problematic about your response. In the instance quoted above, you chose to make your point using the unfortunate comparison of a man (an historically privileged group) beating his wife—a presumably one-time instance—and later seeking to explain his behavior away because he'd been drunk.

Perhaps your point would have been slightly better made had you chosen to describe a woman (an historically marginalized group), who had been on the receiving end of gross physical, emotional, and sexual abuse at the hands of her husband for decades, and because the system refused to provide her with either justice or protection, she became overwhelmed with futility and despair and finally "snapped." By which I mean—quite specifically—that she spray painted curses on the walls of her husband's business and busted out the windows of his truck before being tazed, pepper sprayed, and arrested. 

Still an inaccurate comparison, but a little closer to what we're all looking at now, no?

The reason that it's an inaccurate analogy either way, is because you were attempting to describe direct physical violence ("dude beats his wife"). Still, however uncomfortable it makes you from a distance, or however much financial and emotional suffering it creates for those directly affected, the loss of property is not, strictly speaking, a violence. It is destructive, yes. Painful, yes. But until we see protestors—by which I mean Black American protestors—categorically and wholesale doing physical harm to other people (which we're just not going to see), this isn't a "violent protest" in the way that you mean. 

It IS violent in the sense that many police are directly targeting civilians for attack—with "less-than-lethal" munitions (no such thing exists), tear gas, pepper spray, moving vehicles, and fists. That is why these protests are violent. And it's that violence that inspired them in the first place. The one proves the other.

Moreover, the alt right's "political theater" playbook, which had already been enacted at least as far back as 2015 (when I first encountered it), is presently in full play. Organized agitators have embedded in every protest across the country with the aim of creating maximum chaos. They now have member groups throughout police and military, in all branches, serving in every part of the country. 

To understand what's happening, we have to be capable of seeing nuance and complexity. Yes, there are angry, impulsive youth who are defying curfew and joining in the mayhem. Their actions are dishonorable and unfortunate. But most of these individuals appear to be white. Some of them may indeed be leftist anarchists. But there is no "organization" called Antifa. It is a leaderless movement, an ideology without a structure or a dogma. And it has never murdered anyone as far as we know. Antifa has never radicalized a young man to walk into a church and murder nine innocent people. It has never driven a car into a crowd of peaceful protestors and murdered an innocent young woman. It has never inspired a mentally ill young man to walk into his high school and commit murder with a semi-automatic rifle.

But, hypothetically speaking, "what if" the only people destroying property in any of these protests were the legitimate protestors? If we are too fragile to see, accept, acknowledge, and step forward to help hold the pain, anguish, rage, and despair of our own fellow Americans who have endured centuries of systemic violence and oppression ... if all we can do is clutch our pearls and virtue signal about how they should or shouldn't express their internal devastation, then we are a part of the problem. And that problem is a privilege so pervasive, so deep and ancestral, it just can't see itself.

@runestoneone, one of my closest friends lives near you in Minneapolis, in the area highlighted on your map. Her old neighborhood is destroyed and the street where she and her partner live now has experienced looting, so they've had to take their pets and leave their home for safety. She's sick about it and worried to death about what they may find when they get back.

My heart breaks for all of you, and everyone else likewise affected. I wanted to take a moment to say so, especially in light of what I just posted above. I know that you can hold the complexity, but it felt important to offer a direct message of love and support. ?

Posted by: @runestoneone

Today, I am grieving. HARD.

Asking for prayers. For myself. For my ravaged city. For the soul of our country, shuddering under the strain.

@runestone Just want you to know that I am adding my prayers to the many being said for your protection, for your city’s healing, and for justice, forgiveness, reconciliation and peace to be restored to a deeply fractured country. 

Ugh! It's been a day of laying in bed because I am gut wrenchingly ill. It hurts just to breathe. My skin is crawling and I am consciously just trying to calm myself and ground the immediate city in which I live. I cry a lot. I cry with you! I cry for you! I cry for us all!

A fire is upon us. The powder keg has exploded and it has lit up a thousand cities throughout the U.S. and beyond! Thank God! Thank God! Let justice be heard! Wow some real truth is being expressed! And it needs to be. Shall we listen? How many times do the black people have to scream out in pain for the white people to listen?  When will the powerless be lifted up instead of knocked down. When will power over be seen as an absolute abatement to being humanly civil? When will we see each other as spiritual beings capable of so much more. UGH!

We knew this storm was coming! Many saw it a long time ago. Back in 2008 when Obama became president I told my partner, oh honey a storm is a brewing! We celebrated along with all of you, but still I could not shake the feeling of doom. I knew the backlash of hatred would be rearing its ugly head. And it did. And we got our white supreme leader Trump to spit his (our) vulgarity out for the whole world to see. Is it shocking? To some yes, to others....no. Like it or not it is our history. It is our present as well.

Let this be a rally call. Not to vent or to react. Not to place blame or tear each other apart! But to see. But to hear. The ugly is in front of us, finally becoming visible! To all my black brothers and sisters, I say to you, I am sorry! I am sorry! OMG I am sorry! I am sorry it has taken me so long to see, so long to hear. I will never know what you are feeling right now! The anguish, the anger, the hurt, the sorrow! But, I will stand with you, not beside you, it is your fight. I will stand in front of you because I am white and my chances of dieing is less than yours! I will stand up for you because it is a human thing to do. 

When my partner and I stood in the rain at the SF courthouse to finally be married after 15 years, I was jubilent, yes. I cried. But, I said to my partner, I am scared! She said, What are you afraid of? I said the backlash, because all of the ugly will be let out! She said, "Bring it on!" I said "So be it!" We are coming up on 25 years! We are in this for the long haul. We chose this life! You chose yours. You are right here, right now, at this time to witness living in the U.S.A. during this time of awakening. And to be sure, We Are Alive, to feel this in all the unimaginable ways! Stay Strong! Love to you all! Let's wake this world up! 

Posted by: @vestralux

Posted by: @ana

Like if some dude beats his wife and the next morning says, "Sorry honey, I was drunk and had a bad day at the office. Just venting."    OK, that's a reason for the behavior but it certainly does not excuse it. 

 

Perhaps your point would have been slightly better made had you chosen to describe a woman (an historically marginalized group), who had been on the receiving end of gross physical, emotional, and sexual abuse at the hands of her husband for decades, and because the system refused to provide her with either justice or protection, she became overwhelmed with futility and despair and finally "snapped." By which I mean—quite specifically—that she spray painted curses on the walls of her husband's business and busted out the windows of his truck before being tazed, pepper sprayed, and arrested. 

 

 

Thank you for your thoughtful commentary.

Yes, I can see where I might have made a better comparison.  The empowered venting their anger against the less-powerful is not the same thing as what we see in Minn. 

However the difference with your version is that  it is not as if the abused person trashed the belongings of the abuser.  In MN, the abused persons trashed things in which they have a personal stake and not the belongings of their abuser. (People who happen to own stuff-- like laundromats and corner stores-- are not necessarily the oppressors.   Many marginalized folks aspire to having good jobs and owning property-- does that make them wanna-be evildoers???) 

A better analogy I could have used is the person who says "I'm pissed off at my boss so I'm gonna punch a hole in the wall of my very own bedroom."  How is that productive?   How is that helpful?  How does that solve the problem?  

Maybe I am too logical for this place. Yeah.  I've been pissed off most of my life for a number of reasons.  Do I hit things and throw things and scream at people?  Almost never.  Why not?  Because it accomplishes little except to make people think I'm nuts.  Does it get attention?  Yes indeed it does!!  But my emotional stability has been questioned forever after in the two cases in many decades I can recall where I went berserk screaming at people (not even destroying anything).  Is that a price minorities want to pay?   It's a question they might ask of themselves.

Do I have a magic answer as to what people of color can do to get justice?   I wish to Deities I did.  I just know that trashing the Target store is NOT it.  

And as an addendum---* If *all the destruction is being instigated by outsiders it makes things much more straightforward.  Those people would just be plain evildoers---   and other people they've convinced to join them would be their pawns.  (Sad to say the joiners are now victimized TWICE (well more than twice if you kept a count, I suppose).  And anyone being used ought to be made aware they are being used, to their detriment.  ) 

Sorry for the effing logic.  I am highly empathic, moderately intutive and disgustingly logical all at the same time. So be it. 

On a side note, please can we lay off Ana! We can say what we want to say without calling out another, whereby making it personal. We all have room to grow. Let's try encouraging each other through thoughtful expression.

So many people are concerned by these protests.  But I am not surprised by the intensity that it has reached.

Consider this.  For the last few years, we have had to suffer under the rule of a president who has made racism acceptable.  If you were racist, you could walk down the street and be proud of the fact, because if people were upset that you hated blacks, muslims, or Hispanics, then they were crazy liberals who were trying to be politically correct all the time, etc. etc.  If you had a person in your life who was openly racist, you were expected to rolled your eyes at their antics but keep a respectful silence.

But now the birds have come home to roost.  The African American community have had enough. 

For years, we have had to listen to Trump belittle Obama and accuse him of not being an American (remember the birth certificate).  We have listened to Republicans and Trump support white supremists in their quest to keep Rebel flags and Civil War Monuments around, even when one of their followers killed members of an African American church and another one drove his car into peaceful protestors and killed one woman in Charlottesville.  Trump encouraged his followers to disregard social distancing guidelines and protest against Democratic governors in the face of Covid-19, a disease that has disproportionately affected the African American community.

How much more were we as a nation supposed to take?

The protesters are angry.  Why shouldn't they be?  How many times have things like what happened with Mr. Floyd happened?  And we have a president who encourages his followers to disrespect authority and yet demands that the protesters respect his authority? 

Nevertheless, I feel hopeful.  Although Trump will use this event to scare up his base, the vast majority of the country recognize that if Trump is re-elected, all he will do is continue to cause division, and everyone is sick to death of it.  We want honest dialogue and efforts to correct these problems.  But we won't get that with Trump.  If anything, the problem will get worse the longer he is in office.

We need to go back to the time when racists were afraid to be public about their prejudices.  We need to go back to "political correctness" (or, as I prefer to call it, empathic listening or respectful speech).  By accepting racism in our friends and neighbors, we have made it socially acceptable, which means that more deaths like Mr. Floyd's will continue to occur.

The time has come to give Trump's MAGA message a good swift kick in the tail.  This country includes all of us.  African Americans, White Americans, Hispanic Americans, Asian Americans, Native Americans, Pacific Islander Americans, Middle Eastern Americans, immigrants, men, women, etc.  WE ALL DESERVE TO BE RESPECTED!  WE ALL DESERVE TO BE HEARD!  AND WE DESERVE THE RIGHT TO GET ANGRY WHEN WE SEE INJUSTICE!!!!!!

So take heart.  We will heal as a country.  We are grieving and raging now, but our anger and grief can turn to action.  Yes, people are losing their jobs and homes. Yes, businesses and property are being damaged. Yes, people are dying and we seem powerless to stop it. 

But we are far from powerless.  We are helping people in need right now.  We are social distancing, practicing sustainable living, doing what we can for the environment, making our voices heard, and trying to uphold one another during this difficult time.

So see the sliver of sunlight through this darkness.  For all of Trump's bluster, his followers are no where to be seen to protect him at the White House.  It is one thing to encourage your followers to harass Democratic governors in protest of stay-at-home orders.  It is quite another to ask them to face hundreds of thousands of protestors who are sick to death over injustice.

Let our light shine through the darkness, and let our anger over injustice become positive change for all.

Posted by: @timo

We can say what we want to say without calling out another, whereby making it personal. 

Of course. I never thought my initial remarks would be interpreted so harshly and I was quite surprised when a firestorm started.