@elainesk. During Read the Future Night in February, I saw Scotland voting on the independence issue in the fall of this year.  Now I’m very curious about the outcome of today’s election.
@tgraf66 I am descended from clan Anderson in Fifeshire near St. Andrews and clan McKay from the northern Highlands.  There are more of course, but I haven’t gone down the genealogy rabbit hole for a while. Â
@bluebelle If we are going to talk ancestry, my maiden name is Bruce and I am descended from Robert the Bruce along with a million other people. My older brother has all the documents. Â I just enjoy the plaid.Â
@coyote Scots only took on English as their main language in the 18th century when Act of Union happened. Gaelic is our smallest but oldest language that is still very much a used language on our islands and parts of our Highlands though there was Gaelic used even down in Fife where l live, most of our towns and villages have Garlic names and you can see the English/Gaelic railway station/town/ village/City names. New Scots and those who support the British Union want the Scottish Gov to stop spending money on a proud Scots language. The more vast language is Scots Tongue or in Scots "Mither Tongue" ( Mother tongue). Before 2014 many pro Indy folk brought it back, we were under English education supposed to be British but they taught us not to speak our Mither Tongue or write it. We do now in most cases on social networking. My Mum came from Aberdeenshire, her language was Doric and my German Dad fell in love with her, spoke Oxford English but didn't understand what they said.. lol.
Once you are connected to a clan, it spirals into many others, if they weren't killing each others clan, they married. My main Clan is McGregor x
@bluebelle It is frustrating not getting any results till Friday, Sat or even Sunday because of Covid, l guess l am suspicious of interference like we suspected in 2014. The UKGov and 99% of British media including majority of English HQd media who say they are a Scottish media. Poor Nicola has been hounded in the most appalling misogynist way with so much propaganda but in the 7 years she has been First Minister, her honesty has always shone through and none of her enemies could trip her up, the Yes/SNP people called them out on their propaganda backed with proof and New Yessers learnt not to trust the British media. There seems to be talk among politicians and media that Nicola could win a very small margin of majority a nd that would make a lot of Scots very happy.
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Most polls over several years have 16/34 year olds around 70% pro Indy/pro SNP. A majority win is the trigger to our Democratic right for an Indy referendum and UKGov have already said they would take ScotGov to court against it but Scotland has our own Legal System, courts, judges, Police etc and then where England says no, Scots say yes and the Supreme Court is next, if they deny Scotland its legal, Democratic right to self determine we will take it to International Court and win it there. Bullying arrogant England still live in Colonial days forgetting the Act of Union was an equal partnership, they do not own Scotland.
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Europe are openly saying they want Scotland back in EU. Nicola has said we getting through Pandemic first, its possible Autumn may be a date of triggering campaign for Indy Ref which was 2 and half years long last time to gain more support we were as high as 58% for Indy but the infighting of that nasty tiny Indy party that appeared just months ago has put of Scots so its 50% now. Maybe a referendum in 2022/2023.
If Scotland goes Independent, then I want to live in Scotland!
I live in Northern England, and I know many English in the North feel there is a North and South divide, not just between England and Scotland, but between Northern England and Southern England. The Westminster elites who are part of the Tory government, have historically screwed over Northern England, and have done so again with brexit.
My sister's husband is Scottish and his whole family are wonderful. I would definitely say their progressive political views are more in line with mine than where I live.Â
In many ways, independence would probably be the wake up call that the Tory government needs. I really hope that in England, labour, the green party, and liberal democrats can regain control from the Tories/Conservatives. I also would love for us to one day remain the EU again, or at the very least, have a closer relationship than we do right now.
Sorry to derail the topic slightly.
I was born a Wallace and married a Gillis so there ya go.
"@bluebelle If we are going to talk ancestry, my maiden name is Bruce and I am descended from Robert the Bruce along with a million other people. My older brother has all the documents. Â I just enjoy the plaid."Â
When my son married he wanted it to be a truly Scottish wedding in Highlands dressed in the full McGregor Highland dress, they wanted to be married on the edge of a Loch Farr, it was a Celebrant who legally married them and they drank whisky from a Quaich Cup, his bride and her family are from England so they were able to see her in white but after they married he put the McGregor tartan sash across her.
He wanted to give me a wedding that would make any Scot proud especially and brought their marriage forward a year because l had been told l had terminal brain Mets cancer so l was so proud of them pulling it off in 21 weeks. That was in 2019 and thankfully l'm still here ?
Robert the Bruce and William Wallace are our heroes, Robert's sister Christiana de Bruis married my ancestor Sir Andrew de Moray who is my 2nd cousin 22xremoved. Because Scotland is small and not a big population back then its amazing how our DNA crossed the world and you are part of King Robert's lineage, not enough Scots were given Scottish history over several decades, many of us older ones learnt from our own interest, England denied us that right, only when SNP came to power in 2007 did education change x
@luminous We had over 400k English Scots before Brexit and many thousands who were Remainers moved to Scotland, the UK has always been centralised to London and South East and Northern England and devolved Nations have been bled dry to prop the wealthy up. You are more than welcome like all others that see Scotland as the door back to EU, Scots want a Scotland that is fair and equal and full of renewable energy, we can build a Nation which ticks the boxes of looking after our planet and our people x
There are a few places where I would love to live in the future: Scotland (anywhere), San Francisco/San Jose, Massachusetts (Salem area), Seattle, and Canada (Vancouver, Nova Scotia).
I like to keep my options open and dreams alive.
If we are sharing our Scots roots, my mother’s mother was born a Robertson, and my mother’s paternal grandmother was born a Campbell.
@jeanne-mayell A lovely story was a woman from Connecticut was doing her ancestry because she has not long before found out she was adopted in Canada and grew up in America. Her Uncle, his wife, her Gran & Grandfather moved to Canada from Scotland Soon after there was a bad accident, her Grandmother and Uncle were killed and her Mother and Father survived. Her father married and moved with his new wife and her to Santa Ana. She would probably not have discovered her real heritage had it not been that her adopted Mother who was suffering Dementia blurted out that she was adopted and after her Adopted Mother died she searched for any clues on her Heritage. What she found was an amazing link to so many of her fairly close relatives still alive in Scotland, England and Ireland. Her ancestry connected her and I to my Great, Great, Great Grandfather McGregor so we met up when the family wanted to come over to UK and she and her family travelled to the region of our McGregor ancestors in Perthshire but she also had Glasgow and Irish connections to her Father's side of Roberton a surname I think which eventually because Robertson.  I met her and family in Edinburgh and we had a very interesting few hours in Scotland's Record library where all births, deaths, marriages and census etc were kept.
I have connected to a few DNA connections in US, New Zealand, Australia who a very, very distant connection to my Mother's Mother's side of family who emigrated to Australia and her niece happens to be Ashleigh Barty who was number one World tennis player, the Barty surname is the long connection to one branch of my Mother's side. The beauty of Scotland is, it is so easy to find connections especially DNA because with majority of folk having connection to Clans there is a wealth of history out there when the information dries up on documents. I wish I had started my journey into my DNA ancestry when my dear Mum was alive, she would have loved to have seen her family tree unfold and see where she received her Dalziel middle name, middle names tend to be surnames of a part of the family branch carried on down generations. This is an interesting page, it tells you how the first names were so named, it helps when you track down a connection and it help give you proof of a connection. Not always a name handed down but 99% of the time.Â
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/blog/help/traditional-scottish-naming-patterns
It was a very good win by SNP and Nicola, we were one short of a majority for SNP to be a full Gov, we are thankful though that again Scottish Greens are pro Independent and their 8 seats takes us to a majority and both parties work well. When we first got our Devolved Parliament after fighting for it for 18 years after our first defeat in 1979, Labour the party who delivered Devolution to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland made sure in Scotland there would never be one party who had full Government, this was in case SNP ever had enough seats that would make a majority happen. In 2011 it did happen by some fluke, no one thinking Scots would go all out for SNP but what was once a Labour party control for decades across Scotland, it all of a sudden turned Yellow the colour of SNP and Scotland was shocked, this is why we got our first independence referendum. What angers us is legally it is Westminster that holds the power whether Scotland can have an Indy Ref, sadly we failed our Indy in 2014 but England made sure they got their non binding Brexit result, definitely rules for England and not for anywhere else. Â
Nicola has been in power for 7 years, she has stayed the most popular leader across all 4 Nations, SNP have been in overall power for 14 years, how many democratic Nations still have such a popular leader and politicians still winning their seats in all that time AND increasing the number of votes in most if not all Constituency votes. WE had a highest turnout of voting for Scottish Election but it was the tactical voting between the unionist parties, two enemy parties, Labour a socialist party(hasnt been that in decades) whose voters were victims of Margaret Thatcher when she pretty much destroyed all of Scotland's industries and then poached our talent leaving Scotland without our sons and daughters.....these parties now lend each other their votes in Constituencies to stop SNP. Hard to believe there are Scottish born who love England more than their own Nation and would trap us in a broken, unequal, corrupt union led by the biggest crook to ever be Prime Minister. It seems he is calling an important Devolution meeting to try and save the union, what it seems he is promising, are the fake love bombs that we had thrown at us in 2014, the "please don't go, we love you, we need you" then the minute the No to Indy vote won it was back to ridiculing, insulting and racially abusing Scots and Scotland.
It is all just a con from Westminster but they intend playing so dirty, Scots have had to listen to English media talk about my country as if it were England's possession, I feel we have been transported to Colonial times and Skynews, BBCnews all pretty much having English spokespeople talking about Scots as if our choice is irrelevant and talking about Prime Minister taking Scotland to court because we want Indy. It is heading for a Constitutional Crisis, Scotland will go to Scottish Court, Westminster is threatening to take Scotland to court then it will go to Supreme Court but all these unionist English media who have been the most evil of hacks in their trying to destroy Nicola for years, this attitude that England thinks it can dictate Scotland, what would happen if Supreme Court declined Scotland getting our Section 30, then Scotland will go to International Court. One thing for sure, the anger against England is bubbling deeply, how can an Act of Union which was entered in peace where it was agreed that Scotland and England were Nations of Equals yet here we are, though we have felt it for years, England shafting Scotland on so many things yet treating us as the underclass. The anger and want for Indy will increase, no person in the south gets to tell Scottish people they can't do this or that because England decides.
To the world the reputation of England will be on the line for not respecting the democratic right of the Scottish people because we all know if you don't respect Democracy you are in the same league as all the state controlled Dictators of the world and certainly not a respectable, Democratic UK and I would think well over 60 Nations who broke free of England's Westminster Colonialism will be cheering on Scotland, even Europe is telling us they support us and if we are Independent it won't be hard to get back to EU. Whatever faults EU has, they have been better friends than the powers and media in England. To be honest, I don't think these Tory toffs never seen Scotland as an equal over the centuries, I think they only ever seen us as their possession. We have a lot of support from English people empathetic to us, many want to live in an Indy Scotland and then you get the union flag waving fascists and racists who believe the lies that we are subsidised that "lets get rid of Scotland" of which we say go ahead, get a petition going and take the many thousands of signatures to Prime Minister where he has his voters demanding he gets rid of Scotland, how better to help us eh!;-)
The long and the short of it, without Scotland's wealthy resources, the dumping ground they use Scotland for their rotting nuclear subs and the monstrosity Trident which Westminster know Scotland wants rid of, there have been several little accidents and we fear one day will be a big accident, the way we believe, Scotland's lives don't matter, Westminster won't have it in England because any of their Naval Bases whose nearest towns are shorter than the distance it is supposed to be, in Scotland, Glasgow is a shorter distance to the safety requirement but hey! Scottish lives don't matter and if it go BOOM! England and Wales and Northern Ireland are safe but most of Scotland are blown away or high in radiation. Sorry for rambling but I dearly hope one day I will read about someone seeing Scotland winning its right to hold another Indy Ref and us finally being free of Westminster and its rotting and corrupt Govs, it beggars believe that nearly all England now votes for a clown who makes and breaks his own rules and is so full of Chronyism, that is the beginning of a Dictatorship where the voters turned a blind eye to corruption. xx
https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/gallery/2014/sep/19/every-single-country-that-has-left-the-united-kingdom-mapped
I do toally sympathise. I live in Northern England and some of us want to devolve and have independence from Westminster as well!
I have lived both in South East England Near London and in Northern England throughout my life, and there definitely is a feeling of North and South disconnect. So I can only imagine it feels even worse in Scotland.
Too many in Westminster just have no understanding or clue about life outside of their bubble. They have no idea what ordinary people want, other than what their rich friends want. The whole brexit saga has also been a total con.Â
I don't know what the futue holds for Scotland. But, I'm getting a sense that there will be more devolved power to Scotland and throughout the UK in general. I think there could be a push for more decentralised power, and potentially reform of the political system in general. I don't know who will implement this, but I think it's going to happen over the next 4-5 years. I also get the feeling that the greens, lib dems and labour are going to have a bit of a revival across the UK - we saw a little of that already with the local elections across the UK, except for Labour. But I see the UK following the US lead in progressive movements. I don't think conservatism is going to be as popular with a more liberal US leading the world. This can only be a good thing for everybody.
@elainesk. I saw another vote for Scottish independence in the fall during our last Read the Future night.  I haven’t the faintest idea how the referendums work or when significant votes would be held in Scotland, but I did pick something up during the prediction exercise.  I don’t know if the timing is right on that prediction, but I do think Scotland will be independent again.  May it be so.
@bluebelle An independent Scotland feels right to me too. Â Boris Johnson's country is going to find itself isolated.Â
@bluebelle An independent Scotland feels right to me too. Â Boris Johnson's country is going to find itself isolated.Â
Very interesting. I want to ask you about the UK, so I will do that in the other thread. I have cooled down a bit from my anger towards Boris Johnson and the Conservatives now. ;-)
@luminous There absolutely needs change, centralised governing has failed so many parts of UK. City of London and the South East have bled all other parts dry, they have gotten richer while we have gotten poorer and infrastructure is mainly built only for the wealthy areas of England to the detriment of Northern England esp and Scotland and Wales.
@luminous There absolutely needs change, centralised governing has failed so many parts of UK. City of London and the South East have bled all other parts dry, they have gotten richer while we have gotten poorer and infrastructure is mainly built only for the wealthy areas of England to the detriment of Northern England esp and Scotland and Wales.
Yeah I agree.
For healthcare on the NHS there has even been a large gap in funding. In the at least 5 years, 4 of those I was travelling from Northern England to London just for hospital tests - because they did not have the same type of specialist equipment at the hospitals near me. I also met on my travels quite a few people who had travelled all the way from Scotland to go to the same hospital in London I was at. It's exhausting travelling from Northern England, I can't imagine how exhausting it was for people traveling from Scotland.Â
Not only that, I really do agree with the way Scotland helps fund their social care for example more than the rest of the UK. It is a major problem in England with lots of elderly people not getting the right care at home.Â
Lots of really good progressive ideas in Scotland - very forward thinking!Â
My hope is that Scotland's independence helps reform the political system and allows for more progressive policies and more powers locally to people to all parts of the UK. It's long overdue.