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[Closed] Helsinki + Putin + Trump = The Day Democracy Died

(@unk-p)
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Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1041
 

a big (yellow) hair plug!



   
Jeanne Mayell, RunestoneOne, Michele and 5 people reacted
 SDJ
(@sdj)
Estimable Member
Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 49
 

Ugh. "Drain the swamp" was Mussolini's campaign motto. I hate hearing it. It's just a suprisingly and jarringly audible dog-whistle for the fascists in our government and nation. More Christian Nationalism stuff. Why do they always need dog whistles, anyway? 

I believe that when Putin told Trump that "the ball was in his court," that he meant the opposite. Of course. Putin has the upper hand. If Putin wants to create chaos, which he has been doing so spectacularly well lately, he can start leaking the evidence he holds of financial crimes the Trump family has committed over the years they have been working for the Russian Mafia. If Putin wants the American people to willingly drop out of Democracy, he could release that while we watch the GOP do nothing to censure or prosecute the President or his blood ties.

They only thing that matters to Americans is money. Crass, but true. We will go through a financial revolution, that is fated and set in stone. When we find it difficult to make ends meet, we'll pay attention to what happens at the top. I find this revolting to think or write, but most Americans don't really know or care about this country. They take it for granted. Putin couldn't have an easier time of it here. Do the American people care if Trump considers sending American diplomats to Russia to be tortured and probably killed? They would only care if Clinton had considered it (OMG, NEVER), but because it's the GOP, it's totally legitmate. 



   
Bee and Anonymous reacted
(@michele-b)
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All puns intended Unk P. Nice catch.



   
(@natalie)
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Posts: 258
 

"all Americans care about is money" Unfortunately there's some truth in that statement. For me it's only really republican voters who feel this way but it's nauseating to listen to them lecture me all the same. They would rather keep more of their tax dollars and watch 50 000 of their fellow citizens die every year because they can't afford healthcare then give up a small sliver of that money to ensure everyone's well being. The same goes for higher education, public schools, roads, post offices you name it, the only thing they like financially paying for is the military, everything else is socialism and therefore evil. 

Greed and selfishness are part of the makeup of this culture and it's time for a powerful punch to the gut to teach all of us to value each other more than we value material wealth. I have often wondered what people like this will do and feel like if they are in a position to need the assistance of others. I've had some visions of it and all I've gotten so far about people in my own life that fit the description above is that in 2030 they are not very happy and look shabbier and less well off.



   
(@brandy)
Estimable Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 60
 

I don't think Kelly turned out the lights. The lights dimmed until they were out. It wasn't like when you hit the switch and they just turn off.



   
RosieHeart and Anonymous reacted
(@zoron)
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Joined: 2 years ago
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I've been playing with my Osho Zen tarot deck a lot this summer and threw on where Kelly and Mattis were at right after the press conference featuring Trump and Putin in Helsinki.   Kelly was in sorrow and Mattis was jubilant (success); very contrasting points of view.  



   
Jeanne Mayell, RosieHeart, Anonymous and 1 people reacted
(@paul-w)
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That doesn't ring true for Mattis unless there is something that we don't know (there are many things that we don't know). I could see it if Trump fell into a trap set by the national security establishment as one step in the path to remove him from office maybe. Otherwise, that press conference, and the whole European tour, goes against everything that Mattis holds dear.



   
Jeanne Mayell, mariad, Anonymous and 1 people reacted
(@rosieheart)
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Joined: 8 years ago
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Could it be that Mattis' definition of "success" is minimizing Trump's damage, or seeing him removed from office, and Helsinki was the start of that?    

And perhaps Kelly's "sorrow" is seeing the damage being done and not being able to prevent it or sorrow over the misuse of presidential power.

Just suggesting an alternative interpretation.

As an aside, I read that last week (right after Helsinki) Mattis changed the nuclear activation protocol for the military. Previously, when the president ordered a nuke strike,  the military decision to follow the command was made by committee.  Mattis has now given total control over the decision to General Hyten who is on record as saying that if Trump ordered an illegal nuke strike, the military would refuse to follow the command.   

Two articles on this (read both):

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/19/politics/mattis-dunford-nuclear-changes/index.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/11/18/trump-nuclear-launch-order-john-hyten/878323001/

 

 

 

 

 



   
Jeanne Mayell, mariad, Anonymous and 1 people reacted
(@brandy)
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from what I have read from others it is possible that Matthis started the wheels moving in a plan to remove T which he did right after the Nato performance. if this is true then Matthis would have been very happy that what he did what he did  after seeing T with P.



   
KB, mariad, RosieHeart and 3 people reacted
(@zoron)
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While no aspect of the military industrial complex ever inspired my trust previous to Trump's presidency, I must admit that I have experienced no small amount of relief in viewing Flynn as an aberration in the general character of American military leaders and in assuming that these leaders have been working with one another to keep a steady hand on the wheel, as Paul and RosieHeart suggest.  I don't want to let go of that assumption and truly hope and pray it is not a false one.   The problem is that they are sworn to defend the U.S. Constitution against foreign and domestic enemies but also to obey the President; quite a pickle, especially given Trump's heated rhetoric towards Iran.



   
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