Thanks Rain, for this info. I went to Union Theological Seminary in the 1980s, it's the most radical seminary in the US (Cornel West taught there for a while), and is trustworthy. Also have seen and heard Rev. William Barber, head of the Poor People's Campaign and Moral Mondays. A *phenomenal* man, a 21st century MLK Jr, but more gender/sexual/racial-ethnic intersectional and anti-capitalist in his analysis and activism.
To all of you: I don't often post on this site, but I come here often and it gives me such solace and hope in these turbulent times. To all of you, deep enduring thanks.
I can't say I am psychic, though I am intuitive. In the last three weeks, I keep getting the same image of Trump. Actually, it's not just an image, but kinesthetic. I feel what I am seeing: It's early am in the White House, he gets out of bed, tangles up at his legs, caught and awkward, stumbles and falls. Then it repeats. And repeats, like caught a loop. The fall is a big thump. He can't get up, calls out but since the door is locked (he locks it from the inside), no one can get to him easily. I can project alot onto this image, but will just leave what I see.
Just so everyone is clear. The EO of today does not represent: a change of heart, capitulation, bowing to pressure. What it represents is pure, cold political calculation.
This is how Cheetolini works: Do something atrocious, whip up the masses, appease the base. Meanwhile, push through other nefarious acts while no one is watching. Then pretend to concede without really conceding anything.
The new order is to jail families together, INDEFINITELY, IN CONCENTRATION CAMPS. Which is illegal (google "Flores rule"). AND the children who have already been separated from family will NOT be reunited. They are being disappeared into the foster care systems around the country, notably in Michigan, Kansas.
The devil is in the details.
that signing today was all for show. The separated children will not be reunited and if after 20 days if a person hasn't been processed then their children will be taken again.
Melania Trump contacted Secret Service after Peter Fonda tweets
"WE SHOULD RIP BARRON TRUMP FROM HIS MOTHER’S ARMS AND PUT HIM IN A CAGE WITH PEDOPHILES AND SEE IF MOTHER WILL WILL STAND UP AGAINST THE GIANT ASSHOLE SHE IS MARRIED TO. 90 MILLION PEOPLE IN THE STREETS ON THE SAME WEEKEND IN THE COUNTRY. F---," he wrote on Twitter.
Too bad Melania didn't respond like this when all those other children were being taken. Please keep all these separated children in the light. there are some rumors that some are being sold into slavery. I know this is probably just rumor but God only knows with these people. If not all the children and parents are reunited we will never know if this is what happened to them.
One more thing: 2 families are suing the gov't. for injecting their very young children with drugs. It is posted in a few places and on Snopes.
So many aspects of this situation are alarming. In late April DHS admitted to Congress that more than 7,000 unaccompanied minors had been placed with "sponsors" since October, and 1,500 of those youths are missing. And, I just followed R1's link to https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/bondfund, where the site explains that "immigrants placed in detention can't get released from ICE custody to reunite with their families until they pay the full amount of their immigration bond. Bonds are set at a MINIMUM of $1500, and are usually in the range of $5-10K, even for asylum seekers without any criminal history. Unlike in the criminal system, bail bond companies either do not help people in immigration proceedings or impose very strict requirements, like private ankle monitors (which families have to pay to "rent")." The horror of this situation just never ends!
I like keridad’s vision of trump getting all tangled up in himself. Thank you Keri dad for coming forward!
This whole episode which is still not over, has said so much to me about individuals and their capacity for empathy for people they don’t know.
I always wondered how Rachel Maddow was able to keep such a strong exterior when reporting about trump. She’s very intuitive and sees trump and his sycophants clearly. But I’ve always felt she could handle all this negative news so much better than I can, until I her breakdown live on camera, knowing she did not want to do that while reporting, I says much about her.
Then there were the trump family reactions. :-( None of them showed any feelings for the victims, just concern about appearance. The GOP — concern about votes.
So now we know what those "FEMA CAMPS" are for. Not for emergencies, but housing those who are in some way unwanted and unwelcome by the Government. All those who raised the issue of the camps, were told that they were "Conspiracy theorists", and that they needed psychiatric assessment and treatment. It actually turns out that it is the President of the United States who needs secure hospitalization. God help us all. The USA has turned into a madhouse. So in these "Detention centers", some families will be held, some children will remain incarcerated In private childrens prisons, some will remain "Disappeared" and might never be found, seized children are being forcibly injected with drugs.....(why?...what for?). and much else. Some suicides have already happened. What else is to come?......I have had fleeting glimpses of the coming protests. They will be ignored, and also attract right-wing attention in dangerous ways. But thank God that some people are standing up, and bearing witness. The last time this happend, was in the sixties.
Zoron, I think in some ways protests are more for the people protesting. Dunno if you've ever marched, but there is something of an energy in the air, a feeling of solidarity and not being alone in your horror about an awful situation.
Experienced protesters know that the media may be instructed not to report on a protest, or that numbers will be reported far lower than the real number...or that the FBI will have undercover agents shoving cameras in your face for closeups in their files...or that hundreds of state and national agencies will swarm a protest working out new crowd control measures like 'kettling'...or that protestors will be hauled away and bound with bags over their heads in stress positions for hours, only to be dumped barefoot out of town without money or phones. Experienced protesters teach survival and countermeasures. Right wing oppression only engenders more solidarity as the righteousness of the protest becomes clearer.
As to why children are forcibly injected with drugs, it's because of the policy to "avoid sexual abuse by avoiding touching" rule. Those penned children are not allowed to be touched, comforted or held. So they are wailing and sobbing and going into hysteria. Easier to drug them than to listen to the sound of your own evil channeled through little throats.
R1
Karidad, I sort of get what you are saying.let us await events.
Runestone: "Protestors will be hauled away and bound with bags over their heads in stress positions for hours, only to be dumped barefoot out of town without money or phones." In most countries, theycall this torture. Its a violation of international law. It used to be done only to Guantanamo camp inmates. I now see that it has gone mainstream, in the USA, against American citizens. I think America is going through a tipping point.
"
I find the whole situation abhorrent. I find Rachael Maddow's emotion reflective of so many in the US, in spite of polling numbers. Remember what Mr. Roger's used to say "look for the helpers."
In spite of yesterday's smoke and mirrors Executive Order, protests will still go on. You can find your closest march here: https://front.moveon.org/
I'm pleased to also note that in the last 5 days, a Facebook fundraiser has raised over 15 million dollars to aid those in distress, contributed by over 400 thousand individuals. RAICES campaign: Reunite an Immigrant Parent With Their Child
It's also very disturbing to note that the drugging of minor immigrants is nothing new. As noted in this lawsuit, there are teens who have been given psychotropic drugs when it is not recommended that such drugs be administered to adolescents, as such drugs can cause behavioral issues or thoughts of suicide/violence. They then detain the youth longer, claiming they can't release them because of the behaviors. It's atrocious. Flores vs Jeff Sessions
I am heartened to see that people continue to take a stand, as well as disheartened that we even have to have such fundraisers and protests. I just keep reminding myself that any infection has to have symptoms appear before it's presence is discovered and a subsequent and appropriate treatment administered.
These days I get feelings towards the perpetrators and towards people who support trump that I don’t want to have. I’m trying to turn those feelings over to the Universe.
The poet John O’Donahue said, “Unless you see a thing in the eye of love, you don’t actually see it at all.”
This is hard to do but unless I do it, my heart suffers.
I had a "lovely" Facebook conversation with two guys (early/mid 50's) that I've known since elementary school.
I put it to them that there are two issues to this event 1) Moral 2) Political
While we can disagree on the Political issue at hand, I asked them the "simple" question, Is it moral to remove the kids from their parents?
When posed with the question, neither would answer it. One person tried to muddy the waters by saying we remove children from parents for other crimes (he is a retired police officer), so why would this be different. The second went off on wild tangents, accusing me of effectively being holier than thou, a liberal who doesn't understand common sense, and other colorful accusations. I pointed out he still hadn't answered my question which unleashed a new tirade. Finally, he answered it that, in a perfect world, no the kids shouldn't be separated. I responded that there is no such thing as a "perfect world" and the my idea of perfection would not be his idea of perfection.
Guess I found a pair of the 30% who have no moral disagreement with this. I don't know what has made their hearts so cold and stone like. It would be way to easy to berate them as being heartless bigots (which they effectively are) because, well who am I to judge.
But I guess the real dilemna I find is I'm told that every person is doing their best every day (from a spiritual mindset). I have a hard time applying this to these guys, because it seems like a simple thing (to me) to understand that this is a horrible thing to do. Are they so low that they can't even see this? Do I cut them out of my life (neither plays even a minor role in it)? Is that the loving thing to do?
Are those who respond with wild tirades denying the humanity of another aware on some level that they are wrong? Aren't the tirades a defense mechanism, a way to deny a truth known in the gut?
As a practical matter, I tend to avoid those in my orbit who treat others poorly. I lack the intestinal fortitude for argument. It's a good vs. harm analysis--will I do more good by challenging bigots, or do myself more harm?
R1
Melania just arrived at the border. I have a feeling this wasn’t her idea.
Good morning all. I want to call on Rosieheart, as I have found some important info about the detention centers here in San Diego county.
First, let me start by listing upcoming events, apologies to those of you outside the area, but feel free to pass this info on to people not on this forum who live in SoCal or even the Phoenix-Yuma corridor.
1. Friday - 11am - Rally/press conference with Sen. Kamala Harris at Otay Mesa Detention Center (7488 Calzada de la Fuente, SD CA 92154). ACLU sponsored.
2. Friday 7pm - Interfaith Vigil & Call to Action - Our Lady of Mt. Carmel (2020 Alaquinas Drive, San Ysidro CA 92173), sponsored by San Diego Organizing Project (SDOP).
3. Saturday 10am - Families Belong Together March - Civic Center Plaza to the County Admin Building (aka "the usual route"), organized by Indivisible.
4. Saturday 1pm - MARCH/Rally - begins at 7144 Otay Mesa Rd SD CA 92154 and ends at Otay Mesa Detention Center on Calzada de la Fuente, sponsored by SDOP.
5. Saturday evening (time not given) - Candlelight Vigil, outside OMDC.
SDOP is looking for volunteers for other events and activities, if anyone is interested let me know, I'm not free to post certain things publicly, I can discuss on private emails, though.
AND - I found out from multiple sources why activity outside the child centers here is being discouraged (and instead carried out at the adult center or downtown): essentially, I was correct in my thinking - if there's too much agitation outside the Southwest Key centers, they'll "disappear" the kids, and my ACLU colleagues are saying that these 2 facilities are actually not that bad (i.e., not overcrowded, kids not being drugged, kids being fed) and are mostly occupied by kids who were unaccompanied coming over the border (not through crossings), and are mostly over the age of 10.
That's a lot to take in, thanks for reading. What galls me a bit is that we have multiple orgs doing good works but with no cross-coordination. So everything comes across to the media as small and disorganized. I'm going to try to go to the March at OMDC at 1pm on Saturday, the rest of the times I'm not available.
Have a peaceful day.
Link to FB video from a local indigenous org. I didn't know that OMDC is built on top of a burial ground...
I'm sitting at work right now next to a woman whose husband voted for trump (she didn't vote) and I'm terrified of asking her what she thinks about this issue. She has been very kind and affectionate to me, but is a bit tone deaf when it comes to many issues. My heart hurts, the nonchalance of people around me is depressing (not a strong enough word).
It says a lot about people who instead of answering a question throw tantrums and accuse the person asking the question of being something they consider derogatory. I've long considered myself a liberal, but at this point none of these words have any meaning anymore, because no one knows their definition and instead just throws around insults. Its so juvenile and immature. I've had these discussions with this type of person myself before and now I avoid them, mostly out of exhaustion and resignation that I can't change them. I feel that those who can't answer the simple question of whether this is wrong or not are either completely without conscience (which is unlikely) or being extremely defensive because they feel their ego and worldview is being attacked. It's incredible to me that people can be so narcissistic as to defend the indefensible just because their ego gets hurt. In the end it's all about them - fundamentally the more I think about it I think that the conservative mind is very selfish, self absorbed and interested in the world only from the perspective of how it affects me and my own. It reminds me of children who tend to be very self absorbed until they get older- so when grown people behave like this it really makes me think of little kids throwing tantrums.
My heart hurts, I feel sick inside.
I pray and hope so much that those children and their families are reunited and get the justice they deserve.