I'm still not getting a clear read on the outcome. Part of the problem for me is the fact that this is all happening under a Merc retro, which tends to cloud things a lot. The trial begins on February 8 just as the retrograde conjunction happens, and the end of the retrograde has Mercury in trine to Orange's natal sun (a positive aspect indicating a possible outcome that would be favorable to *him*), so that could be a harbinger of acquittal, but it's still too murky to say.
I have read both the House Managers' well-crafted statement of the case - in which they debunk most of the right wing talking points - as well as the Orange One's typo-riddled restatement of the election fraud lies in his defense statement, and logically, this is a slam dunk against the Orange One. However, the cult of personality on the R side is still very strong, and since neither he nor the rest of the R's use logic and haven't for ages, that's probably not the best way to look at it.
I think the House Managers need to very strongly stress to all of the R's (and Manchin, who is a DINO) that their votes in this case will very plainly expose them politically. Their political futures will likely suffer regardless of which way they vote, but it would be better to come down on the side of democracy than fascism.
I also think this trial will expose a lot more than that. I would think that Lindsey Graham's "threat" of calling in the FBI as witnesses would likely be welcomed by the Managers. It could also introduce information that might implicate Mr. Graham and others, both in this case and in others in which investigations may not yet have begun or even been considered.
A few people on here saw Mr. Graham resigning under some kind of cloud or scandal after the election, and this could well be his Waterloo. As for The Orange....I have no idea.
I am very interested in how the repubs and t's lawyers are going to argue on one side that t is still president because of the fraudulent election and on the other side that t can't be tried because he is no longer president. I am more and more confident that the evidence to convict is going to be overwhelming so much so that at least 17 repubs will find it impossible to acquit. There are tens of thousands leaving their party with more to come if they continue to try to destroy our cherished Democracy.
For those interested, here's Teri Kanefield's very informative thread of a "Cliff's Notes" explanation of the House Managers' statement of the case:
https://twitter.com/Teri_Kanefield/status/1356629257334648832
@jeanne-mayell, i am so glad you deleted that post. I want to apologize to you, and everyone else for the violent imagery and ugly language. I violated my own guidelines about not posting anything while angry. Or drunk. And i was both. (Which is odd, because usually if i drink, i just get all goofy and dance-y, and become even more preposterous than usual). I also try not to use curse words too often- not out of any sense of prudishness, but because those kind of words can represent a failure of the creative imagination.
peace & love to you all
I wish I could be as confident as you, but I am a trial attorney and sadly many cases are not decided by the facts or the truth, but by the emotions, prejudices, and motivations of the people siting in judgment.
I agree with you that the proof will be overwhelming that Trump committed insurrection. However, the idea that at least 17 Republicans will have the moral fortitude to do the right thing is simply not possible. The Republican party is dead. Right now it is being run by a dictator, a bunch of domestic terrorists who (in my humble opinion) have no right to call themselves Americans, and many more cowards who prefer to stay in power over their duty to God and country. Yes, there are a few good moral people left, but they are not the ones calling the shots.
But maybe the country will be so sickened by Republicans' endorsement of domestic terrorism that they lose so badly in 2022 that they finally fall apart.
Sadly, I have been so traumatized by what Trump and the Republicans have put our country through over the last four years (and throughout the last few decades sense they pretended they were the "moral majority") that I don't think I can ever forgive them. How can one trust a group of people who have belittled you, called you names, harassed you, advocated for violence and death against you, and then tried to do that? I can never vote Republican again. How can I? And how can I forgive my Republican neighbors when they outright refuse to change or even acknowledge that what they did was wrong?
+
You don't have to forgive them. That is what G-d and the angels are for...give them to G-d , and tend to your wounds. See them as sick and broken, as they certainly are. If you can muster the grace you can pray for them, but really, it's most important to pray for yourself. Feel better.
@allyn Although I have great respect for your courtroom experiences, I see things from a different perspective. I am convinced we have moved into a new era of change for the better. I have always believed that things would get worse before the end of the patriarchy happened which was evidenced by hitting rock bottom on Jan. 6. It was the last hurrah for that kind of hatred. There will be a few more bumps along the way but look at what is happening already with this inspiring new administration. I have chosen not to give power to the repubs anymore by giving them the benefit of my anger. I can only hope they see the light and joy in the world as those of us here do.
Allyn, I totally relate to your feelings. While I have decided to let go of some of my anger towards the rethugs (that was greatly helped along by the election of Biden) my feelings of disgust and disbelief at their continued party-over-country behavior, their treachery and hypocrisy is still strong. Navalny is headed to prison for another two years and is still speaking out, and our Senators are pissing their pants in fear.
Brighter times are ahead. Biden and Harris are in charge, they've assembled a kick-*ss administration, and from what I've seen so far, I badly underestimated Biden's ability to beat the rethugs at their own game. The truth will out.
I mentioned a few months back about losing a relationship I care deeply about. This person reached out to me, and as angry as I was, I decided to meet halfway because I didn't want the relationship to be yet another casualty of that evil person. I still have to stomp down my feelings of resentment sometimes, and my incredulousness that someone that smart could vote for that jack*ss, but so far, so good.
That is not to say it's blackberry shortcake time. They all need to be brought to justice and go to prison.