Hello, I just want to add my voice to the chorus here. For a very long time now I have had a vision of Trumpfus literally "going down". I see him in the White House falling to the floor, crawling a bit and vomiting. Although he lives through the episode, it is really the end of him.
In any story, right about the time you fear the monstrous demagogue can't be toppled, lightening strikes from above or a big enough stone in a perfectly aimed sling strikes from below. When that time comes, I don't really care where he goes. Only that he does.
Ah yes, Vestralux. You've nailed him not to a cross but to a bullseye of some kind.
He's in the crosshairs big time now and we await our little symbolic David and his slingshot!
Ah, sweet Pete are you part of this plan in some way, perhaps? Are we symbolically building a new "church" upon this energetic system currently playing out in our ever so big theatre of the absurd?
Time for our wizard of oz and his yellow brick road paved with gold in the banks and wall street-steals- making of the emerald city of greenbacks and cutbacks and curtained offs walls to have his orange curtain parted to everyone's full view!
If I hadn't been raised by evangelicals, I'd laugh a little harder. It's frightening to me that there are a large number among evangelical leadership who support Trump, precisely because they believe him to be the Antichrist.
They are essentially (or literally) Zionists, and to them, his rise is just one more step toward the rebuilding of Solomon's temple—the prophesied "Third Temple"—in Jerusalem (thus, evangelical Christianity's overwhelming support of Israel); the Great Tribulation (a period of horrific natural and manmade disasters which may or may not last seven years or seventy days); the Rapture (in which God the Almighty Father [cough] beams every worthy living and dead believer up to heaven, and says "you're f*&%ed!" to the rest); the Second Coming of Christ; the Battle of Armageddon (in which Rhaegal, Viserion and Drogon make a shocking cameo); and something like 1,000 years of peace.
After which, the Final Judgment (because the world hasn't been through enough already) and then, POOF, the End of the World.
In more or less that order.
As stupefying as all of this is, it's no less mythic. I mean the antichrist in our story is literally known all over the world for his "golden tower" and wanting so very badly for it to be the tallest in Manhattan. Whatever we believe or don't, that tower's gonna fall.
I've heard/read similar things. That the "christian right" (oxymoron if ever there was one), love Trump because he is causing biblical prophecies to advance. I think the part they miss (about Rapture) is exactly WHO is going up to heaven.
And....heaven forbid if Jesus doesn't look EXACTLY like the white guy in the Italian paintings.....can you imagine if Jesus came back as a black woman from Somalia? If these folks can't handle "Seasons Greetings", they will literally burst blood vessels if Christ looked a whole helluva lot like Ilhan Omar.
Can I just marinate in all that juicy irony for a bit?
The funny thing is that scripture would describe the anti-christ just like Trump. Charming, forked tongue, fact is fiction, black is white, tell you heinous acts are pious.....etc.
I'm screaming loud, for all to hear, about the awfulness of this person and what he represents. Trying to convince his "supporters" to move away from him. But...in a purely selfish way....why should I bother? They have free will, if they support him, they will reap what they sow. But, then I think about those that are being "harmed" by this. My empathy and love goes out to them, thus I press on.
But, I guess, I'm always looking for the kernal of light, trying to fan it into a flame. It is a frustrating and seemingly hopeless wish......a wish that we would rise up....as one....to resist.
Why is this so hard?
@jeannemayell @codyroo @vestralux and everybody, i was thinking we should have a thread about the wholesale inversion of Christianity that has been perpetrated by the so-called christian right. A place to gather all of the evidence together, to use as a reference, for when we need to explain to people that we care about, who have fallen under it's spell. There is so much, that it is hard to keep it all in one person's head.
I have a lifetime of careful research gathered on the subject of this particular Upside Down place, but something I've learned the hard way—long ago and repeatedly since—is that it doesn't matter one iota how much historical, literary, or scientific evidence you collect or present. You can't debate someone on the subject of faith and hope to reason them out of it, or even alter it slightly. You'll end up doing the inverse every.single.time.
Belief is not subject to logic. Faith is at once antecedent to knowledge, and at its best, utterly transcendent of it. And that's just the sort of troubling paradox/beautiful mystery I've learned to let alone.
My family disowned me (not that they owned much) on the basis of their particular Christian faith, and it took me years to see that, fundamentally, they were just trying to be the best sort of people they could. To live by the Word of their "one true God," with the hope initially, I'm sure, of convincing me to become something other than what that same God had made me.
They said and did a lot of unreasonable things in a desperate attempt to be loved by an often cruel and capricious "Father." How could I fault them something I'd been doing myself with the human version? At the end of the day, there are just a lot of traumatized children running around the halls of fundamentalist Christianity.
In my personal experience, the only thing that's ever worked to move the needle between us, to bring us even a little more connection—if not a great deal more two-way understanding—has been another kind of paradox. My own efforts to give them, unselfishly, all the things I'd once so badly needed: kindness, patience, acceptance. Love.
When I found myself living more from there, it was a kind of epiphany. I'm a universalist (my family would probably call me a pagan heathen), but the true essence of the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth are liberating. And that's something I can believe in faithfully, no logic necessary. I no longer need my family's acceptance or kindness or understanding. I can't change their minds; only love can do that. After years of evangelizing to me, they couldn't change mine either. Only love did that.
[To be clear: I'm not suggesting that we should just smile sweetly and accept it when terrible things are done in the name of God or anything else. Spiritual activism is needed. But I do think a lot more success can come from it when we approach people from where they are with compassion for their beliefs, rather than from a position of disdain about their beliefs. In the end, it's just a lot more persuasive.]
Of course, there's always the Douglas Adams method, of which I am a total devotee:
“Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.”
Wow, Vestralux. Thank you for that. It is Upside-Down alright. Sometimes, i think the only thing to do is just stop. And dance! https://youtu.be/JrTtgAQgc04e because nothing else makes sense
Ah yes, Vestralux. You've nailed him not to a cross but to a bullseye of some kind.
He's in the crosshairs big time now and we await our little symbolic David and his slingshot!
Ah, sweet Pete are you part of this plan in some way, perhaps? Are we symbolically building a new "church" upon this energetic system currently playing out in our ever so big theatre of the absurd?
I try to restrain my enthusiasm, because I don’t want to just sound like I’ve drunk the koodlaid on Pete. But I see him that way in my minds eye. Like a David, a warrior of God (maybe not so much the boy David but a young king who dances out of love for for the Lord). Young and with a kind of righteous purity, shining with light and standing up, unafraid, to all the demons of darkness. Like Trump and his enablers and homophobes and other haters.
I love how he just calls things for what they are, points out the hypocrisy, clearly and without anger, but with a firm hand and a bedrock moral authority.
He was given so many personal gifts with his intelligence and looks and spiritually advanced soul. I would like to believe he was meant for this time and that he will lead us into a brighter future. But the darkness of this period is a powerful force. I’m praying for him and for all of us.
FYI Michele, you can find the debate highlights for Pete here:
https://thepetechannel.com/debate-videos
@jholmes and @michele-b-here-in-the-forum
So, so true. He brings absolute delight to my heart.
Also, this line was perfection:
“I’m not scared of this president,” Mr. Buttigieg said on CNN. “I mean, this a guy who was working on season seven of ‘Celebrity Apprentice’ when I was driving armored vehicles outside the wire in Afghanistan. I’m not afraid to take him on.”
Yeah, that was a great moment. When he’s in that mode, he gives off such authentic strength and no-bullshit moral authority. It’s really an interesting vibe. I’ve seen some Trump supporters call him “smug” but I think he’s reflecting the truth to them and it’s hard to look that in the face. Hopefully he can change some hearts and minds.
I imagine it's some pretty tough medicine that a Democrat and a gay man to boot is able to speak like this, and with so much conviction and steely authority. He can come from a place they claim to be about, but with far more authenticity and integrity. And at base, they all know it.
Sometimes smug is smug. Other times, it's what you call someone who makes you feel insecure.
As long as you remember to bring a proper towel ?
Sorry for the off topic hijack, everyone - back to your regularly scheduled thread.
I'm a Christian who believes in the Rapture and I asked Him the other day, out loud, if this is the end times, you couldn't have used someone less vomitous than Twitler? Really? lol
One thing I really don't understand about the right-wingers that Christians are commanded to fight and reject evil in all forms, not embrace it.
@polarberry, I used to live in a town where a certain bumpersticker was popular. It said, "In case of the Rapture, this car will suddenly be unmanned!"
Seeing them all the time made me want one of my own: "In case of the Rapture, can I have your car?"
Thought you might be able to laugh at this from both sides. ?